CatheringByers
===
Marie: [00:00:00] Welcome to the Working Moms of San Antonio podcast. We're your host, Erica Radis and Marie Lifschultz, a realtor and lender here in San Antonio. But most importantly, we're working moms just like you.
Erika Radis: This podcast is all about creating a space where we can come together, share stories, and learn from each other.
We love connecting with local moms and business hearing about their journeys and how they're balancing it all because let's be honest, it's not always easy, but it's so worth it.
Marie: Before we dive in today's episode, we're excited to share some big news with you. All
Catherine Byers: our business community and coworking memberships are officially open.
Whether you're looking for a supportive community of moms and business, or need a beautiful space to work and grow, we've got just what you need here at Working Moms of San Antonio. You can visit the link in our show notes. Or working moms of San antonio.com/membership. For more info
Marie: now onto today's [00:01:00] episode, grab a cup of coffee, settle in, and let's get started.
Erika Radis: Welcome to this week's episode of the Working Moms of San Antonio podcast. Today we are here with our guest, Catherine Byers, and we're gonna turn it over to her to talk about all things estate planning. Yay. It's my favorite things to talk about. Yeah. Great. Yeah. Most people don't like to talk about it, but I could probably could talk about it for days, so, yeah.
Well, I'm excited to hear all the things. Yes. Uh, well, my name's Katherine Byers. Um, I'm an estate planning attorney here in San Antonio, Texas. Um, I've been practicing law now for 10 years, which is so crazy to say. It feels like it was yesterday. I graduated and, you know, it was, excuse me, was studying for the bar and, but all of a sudden it's 10 years later.
So I, I've been doing estate planning for. For the majority of my, of my law career. I did two [00:02:00] years in family law and quickly got out of that and turned to estate planning and I've just fallen in love with it.
Marie: What made you decide to go into
estate planning? Anything in particular? Really? I was on my way out of law school.
I mean, not outta law school, out of law in general. Oh. I mean, I was, I was. Doing family law. Um, and it just, I mean, it was just so awful stressful. I would, these tests, I really appreciate family law attorneys so that I don't have to do that anymore. It's a really tough area. Um, I was really just burnt out.
I was looking for anything that was not, um. Family law and I couldn't find any other law work and so I was looking into financial planning. Yeah. Um, and I found a entry-level position for estate planning and kind of learned it, you know, two years into being a lawyer and I just absolutely loved it. The best thing about it is.
Family laws, a lot of fighting. Mm-hmm. And understandably so, people are going through the worst times of their lives, but estate planning is about trying to plan so that we don't have fights, um, in the long run. Yeah. Oh, I like that. Either during life or even after, [00:03:00] more importantly, after somebody passes.
Got it. Yeah.
Catherine Byers: Well, well, what do you think, I guess, um. What do you think we need to hear today as, as a working moms community in terms of the estate planning and all of that? There's, I know for me there's tons, yeah, there's, there's tons of info. I know for me, I do not have my shit together even a little bit, so maybe we need to hear about it all.
Yeah, no, I mean, it's definitely an area where people don't know about it and they don't really wanna know about it. 'cause it's, it's a hard topic to talk about. We're talking about. People dying, people becoming incapacitated. Mm-hmm. Um, you know, and I just find that people are really kind of scared to approach it.
My goal with any kind of an estate planning, um, conversation is really just to educate on the importance of it.
Marie: Mm-hmm.
Catherine Byers: Um, it, it's really more about, um, and I say this, I tell people all the time, it's not, it's not for you. It, it is for your family. It's for your loved ones because if something happens to you, you're not [00:04:00] gonna be here.
Right. Yeah. You're not gonna be having to deal with, with the consequences. And so the whole point is it is a gift that you can give somebody. Um, and I hear a lot of people tell me like. I'm too young to have an estate plan or I don't have anything, so therefore I don't need anything. And the truth of the matter is, as soon as somebody turns 18, they need a very, just the basic estate plan.
At that point in time, the law considers you an adult. We might not think of an 18-year-old as an adult, but uh, the law says they have their own agency. And so at that point, they need some kind of legal document that says, Hey, I trust mom and dad, or aunt and uncle, or whoever else it might be in their life.
The the third parties out there, they need something that says, I can speak to you for, uh, with your child or, or help make decisions for this child. Sure. Um, so. What we talk about for basic estate planning for anyone who's 18 and up, um, the key documents are gonna look at our durable and medical powers of attorney.
Um, those have become [00:05:00] very popular for kids going off to school, especially, uh, during the pandemic. Uh, we had a ton of parents calling saying, Hey, my kid's in the hospital. I, and they won't speak to me. Like, how is that possible? I'm their parent, I'm their mom, I'm their dad. Yeah. I would never think that.
Really. And the thing is that those people don't know that. Sure. They don't know what kind of relationship that child may have with that parent. Mm-hmm. Um, and so. It became very apparent for these people that hey, we need some kind of legal paperwork. Mm-hmm. Um, and so durable and medical powers of attorney were really, um.
Sort of core documents for any 17, 18-year-old child going off to school and really for anyone, I think at that point, um, too 18 and 18 and up.
Marie: Well, 'cause you just assume as the parent you would have a right to say, make decisions if your child is incapacitated. And that doesn't mean you would be the person.
The courts would pick.
Catherine Byers: Is that, is the same thing true of like a spouse? Yes. Yes. Really? Yeah. 'cause you know, we have people that hate their spouses, right? Yeah. And the spouses can be estranged for years. And [00:06:00] so someone coming in and saying, well, I'm the spouse. Party might say, I really don't care. I don't know if your spouse trusts you.
I don't know if I'm allowed to release this information to you. Um, and so it's just really saying to the world, I am, I am my own agency and I trust these people to come in and make decisions for me.
Marie: Mm-hmm.
Catherine Byers: So durable and medical powers of attorney, they are basically documents that say if I need help with my financial transactions, legal transactions.
Or my healthcare decisions, then I trust this person here. If that person is not around, my favorite word in estate planning is contingency. Mm-hmm. Um, if they're not available, then here's my first or second alternate as backups. Oh.
Marie: I had thought that same thing. I had gone to just a seminar someone was putting on a weekend, a real estate agent invited me to go listen to, and I thought I knew.
I'm like, I thought as my husband, as a wife. Mm-hmm. I would have like, if, if something happened to Roger, I could. Make decisions for him? Nope. [00:07:00] Nope. That's wild. His mom or dad or whomever family member could fight me on stuff and mm-hmm. Because it's family. I mean, it gets messy. We really
Catherine Byers: don't have our stuff.
Like I said in the beginning, I don't have my stuff together now, even more so. Yeah. That's terrifying. Yeah. Um, and then I like to also do a, a HIPAA release for, for clients. Yeah. Whether again, it's a child or a, an adult. Um, you know, I say adult child 18 and up, but, um. But HIPAA is the federal law that protects our healthcare information.
Uh, same thing, right? Mm-hmm. If you just called up and said, Hey, I want this information on my child, by law they're gonna say, I can't release this to you. Right? If they're under 18, that might be one thing, but once they're an adult, yeah. You don't have natural access to anything. Um,
Marie: well, even I right now, like I know for my children's pediatrician, I have a 17-year-old and I have a 15-year-old, and for their well baby checkup, they get this questionnaire that I don't have access to.
That's crazy. They, they have to fill it out. And I'm like, what does it say? Like what? Like it asks [00:08:00] them questions and stuff, and I think it's very bizarre. Like it's hard as a parent, you're like, wait a minute, I've taken you care. You came out of me. Like I shouldn't be able to just look at what you're asking you.
But it's specific questions for them to answer. Yeah. That the, that a doctor gives to them. And I'm like, what? Yeah. Yeah.
Catherine Byers: So, and, and even having, um, a will, like for a child who's 18 and up, um. Again, wills. I get a lot of, uh, I don't have anything. I don't own anything. I'm not old enough to have a will. Again, as soon as you're 18, you know, you may have a bank account, you may have a car.
I mean, those are things, and they may not seem like high value assets, but I promise if you don't have a document afterwards, after you're gone that says, here's who gets my stuff, it's. You're gonna be spending tens of, you know, maybe tens of thousands of dollars in court trying to determine who is allowed to receive it, who's gonna be in charge.
Uh, we have a lot of, you know, divorced parents who have, who share children. Um, and [00:09:00] unfortunately if, if your child preces you, uh, most time the parents are gonna be the heirs. And so if you've got two people that don't communicate mm-hmm. Uh, it can get very ugly very quickly. Mm-hmm. Um, I mean, I had a, I had a case where, um, unfortunately a child had passed.
The parents were fighting over the ashes. I mean, oh gosh. People will fight about anything. Sure. So, um, just having those kind of key basic documents, durable power of attorney, medical power of attorney, HIPAA releases and wills, I mean, very basic documents that anyone 18 and up should have
Marie: and it can be adjusted over time, right?
Absolutely. Absolutely. So it's something I just started thinking about 'cause Tyler's getting going into his senior year. Of of high school, and he, as of right now, wants to stay close, but he might go abroad. I mean, he might, and I'm like, well, who? Like, what if something happens to him? What if you're in a car accident or what if mm-hmm.
Like, and you're in the hospital and they won't let me know what's happening. Yeah. Yeah. So it's something that I've like, wait, it's coming that time. I need to figure that out. Yeah. And it was in a group me, one of our group [00:10:00] chats. People were talking about it. 'cause we have a, a, a friend of ours that had just graduated and he's not 18 yet.
Mm-hmm. And he's going, he's, he's graduated early. He's 17. And. The mom is trying to get information and the school didn't really wanna give her anything. Yeah. She's like, he's a child. Yeah. I'm paying the bill. They don't
Catherine Byers: care. They don't care. No. Their number one concern is liability. Yeah. They don't wanna be sued.
Anybody. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Um, and so they're gonna fall back on, on the law. And the law definitely says, you know, Hey, I don't care if your mom or dad or brother or sister, if, if they're 18 and up and you don't have any paperwork that says, I can speak to you. I'm not going to,
Marie: so can you. I, because for, for me, like if I am wanting to have that.
For my son soon. Mm-hmm. Is that a conversation I should have with him and have with like, how does that work? Like
Catherine Byers: Yeah. I mean, legally speaking, if, if the child or the client is coming in, they're 18 and up, they are the client. And so it really is that attorney client between mm-hmm. You and that child. I keep saying child 'cause I'm thinking like, yeah.
To [00:11:00] me they are children, right. They're 18. I mean, I'm almost 40 at this point, so I feel like 18 year olds are babies still. Yeah. Um, but. I, it, it's your child. So I always say, mm-hmm. Talk to your child. Have a conversation with them. If they then wanna come in and sit down to sign, I always walk them through it and say, are you okay with this?
Because maybe a child feels pressured into naming somebody. Mm-hmm. Um, and so it's really important that they are putting the people that they trust on this form. So if you have a great relationship with your child, you know, have that conversation. But at the end of the day, when they come in to sign.
It'll be the attorney saying, is this what you, what you want?
Marie: Yeah. Is it a time limit on, on those type of documents? Like, you know, like, Hey, this is gonna end at 25, or, or whatever the case is?
Catherine Byers: No, I mean, for the most part we, we say, we say those documents are, um, effective up until you revoke them. Or unfortunately, if you, if you pass away those powers that you're giving somebody goes away when you pass away.
Um, I do tell my [00:12:00] clients on the, uh, durable power of attorney, which is one for money and finances. It's probably good to update those every three to five years, just because if you think about a third party or like a bank, if you come in with a power of attorney that's 15 years old, they're gonna be like, I don't know.
This is kind of. We call it stale. Yeah. Um, medical, not as much medical, you know, you can change 'em over time, of course, but you don't, that one doesn't need to necessarily be updated that often. It's interesting that it's sort of like up to the bank's discretion if they, it's terrible. I, I, I, if they wanna use it or not.
Listen, there's actually, there's a whole statute in the estates code, which I won't bore you with because again, I could talk about this stuff all day, but there's a whole section that talks about third parties and them having to rely on these documents. And if they refuse. If there are legal consequences that as attorneys we can, we can pursue against them.
Yeah. But again, they are ultimately concerned with liability. They're, that document in general is just presented. People automatically get their backup, like, [00:13:00] what is wrong with this person? That they themselves cannot come in and, and withdraw their money or sign this check. Mm-hmm. So they're gonna be naturally suspicious.
So the more current and, and clean it looks. Yeah. Sometimes the, the better. Got it. And what are like. What are the verification processes for that kind of thing? I'm so curious. Like what do they do? Because I too would wonder like, Hey, where is this person? Yeah. Like, what do, do they just ask questions and you just give the information?
Like, that just seems so nuts to me. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, it's just gonna depend on who you're dealing with. And I hate saying that as an attorney. It's like, people like, what about this? I'm like, it's all going to depend. Yeah. On, on that person. You're, you're interacting with. Some, some of these powers of attorney, they're called springing powers of attorney, where they don't become effective until you're disabled or incapacitated.
Mm-hmm. And the document usually defines how you prove that. Usually with a doctor's note or, or some kind of physician writing saying that this person is incapacitated. Um, but a lot of times you, you come in, you present the document, here's my [00:14:00] id, you know, as long as there's a notary stamp and it looks legit.
A lot of times they, they just accept it, so,
Marie: okay. I work for a bank, we accept it. Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, there's certain things, like I I, we do, uh, a live and well check sometimes, like to make, especially on, on VA type loans. Mm-hmm. We can't just have people sign on on behalf of someone and make sure they're alive.
Like if they're signing documents. Um, my biggest concern for, for my family would be like if he was incapacitated. And that I needed to make a decision for his life. Sure. Like, and, and he's 18. Yeah. And he's not at home or, or whatever. Um,
Catherine Byers: but yeah, when I, when I meet with clients for the first time and we're talking about estate planning, I tell 'em, I kind of break it down into two areas.
One is of course the last will and testament. That's what most people jump to when I say estate planning. They're, you're planning for, you know, you're passing and who's gonna get my stuff. But for me, just as important are those are those, we call 'em ancillary documents. Mm-hmm. Which are effective now that take care of you while you're [00:15:00] alive.
Mm-hmm. Planning for those emergency situations, the incapacities, the, the Alzheimer's, the dementia, whatever else it might be. Um, but people tend to neglect those. Yeah. They say like, oh, I don't need that. I'm young, I'm healthy. Until
Marie: you need
Catherine Byers: it. Until you need it. Right. You could be driving down I 35 and or heck on Ebner.
Ebner. ISS a dangerous road. I mean, we're having to walk, we're having construction at our firm, so we're walking up and down Ebner right now. I mean, those cars are going 45, 50 miles an hour. Yeah. There's no guarantee. Um, and the sad part is if you don't have a very simple document that says, here's who I trust and I authorize you to speak to.
If that situation arises and you don't have that, you're, you're in court and you're going through a guardianship process and that, I mean, we easily take a $3,500 retainer to $5,000 retainer just to start that process. Yeah. And take six months, you know, so rather than having to incur those legal court costs and that delay, you know, you, you prep ahead of time.
Yeah. You say, here are these very three or four simple documents. [00:16:00] And it, it just creates such a nice solution to a problem when is presented.
Marie: Again, it's, it's something you'd hope to never have to use. Mm-hmm. But it's, it's something that, again, I, I thought it from for Roger and I, but I just started thinking, oh my God, Tyler's gonna be 18 soon.
Yeah. February. Oh my God, it's coming up so fast. And I'm like, and all that, all those emotions are coming. And then I'm like, whoa. Course, of course he lives at home and stuff, but once he becomes 18. He, his bank account has everything,
Catherine Byers: you know? Yeah, yeah. And, and the, and again, even like with a will for a child who's 18 or older, um, the process, again, I tell clients Wills are a, they are a roadmap, essentially.
Let's say when I die, here's who gets my stuff. Here's who's in charge. If you don't have that, again, the state of Texas, I mean really any state, but mm-hmm. We're in Texas here. There has to be some kind of way to get a deceased party's name off of an asset, whether it's a bank account or a car. Mm-hmm. If you don't have that will to do [00:17:00] that for you, then we're again stuck in court going through a very long judicial process to declare who are the natural heirs at law, and again, most times.
That's gonna be mom and dad. For a, for a young person who's not married and doesn't have kids, well, we see it all the time in real estate. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I mean, usually it's not obviously for children, but you know, we see it all the time where someone passes and there's a will and I guess a will, and maybe you can explain this.
Mm-hmm. 'cause I don't even really know all of this. My title girl helps me with, with this part, but there are wills and then some of them have gone through the probate process. Mm-hmm. And that seems better. Mm-hmm. Yes. If that has happened, yes. Maybe you can expand on what that means. Probate's expensive.
It, it's expensive if you don't have a will. Right. So, so probate really is a judicial process that helps people to transfer title on certain types of assets. So real estate is a, is a huge one. Motor vehicles. But the idea is you hopefully have a will, but that will, you have to present it before a court.
Um, that, and that's that judicial process called probate. [00:18:00] If you don't have that document, then again, we have to go to the court. We have to tell a judge, Hey, here's who I am alleging are the heirs of this estate. We would like this person to be in charge, but they have to get another attorney involved.
They're called an attorney ad litem. They have to investigate to make sure that we're not leaving errors out. Mm. Um, we, if we can't all agree on who's gonna be in charge, then you're fo uh, forced to do something called a dependent administration, and that is very expensive. I just finished one. That was, uh, $17,000.
By the end, we got through everything and it was an, um, an insolvent estate. There's, you know, there's assets, but there's a ton of, a ton of debt. So, um, if you go through probate though, then you kind of get the, the courts back. You can get some kind of legal document that says the will is valid, here are the heirs, here's what authority you have.
And it's, and people do that while they're still living? No. It's after you pass. Oh, I see. At the will. Yeah. Is there something you can do to let your family not have to go through all of that? There's a, there's a ton of alternatives. [00:19:00] The most popular one we see is a living revocable trust. I see. Um, essentially you're retitling things to be owned by a trust versus keeping things in your individual name.
Um. In the real estate world, there's a lot of awesome new things as well. Like a transfer on death deed, lady bird deeds. Those are things where we can, we have right of
Marie: survivorship
Catherine Byers: on ours. Oh my gosh, I'm so glad to hear that. Mm-hmm. Yes. Because in Texas you can, you can actually take title as Right. Uh, espouses with rights of survivorship.
Marie: Yes. So it was something that I, we didn't know about. Someone told us about it. Mm-hmm. And because I've had to go through probate for family members, I've gone through that process and we have family members who have passed who did not have wills and. Spouse, it can get messy. So messy. So, um, someone had mentioned, so for Roger and I, we decided to have the right of survivorship on our title.
So that means it's our biggest asset. Mm-hmm. So if something happens to either one of us, one, one of us doesn't have to go through probate to prove he's the heir of the hou. Like he owns the house and if he needs to sell it, he could sell it.
Catherine Byers: [00:20:00] Right. We need to do that. We need to
Marie: do
Catherine Byers: all of these things.
Yeah. Yeah. I mean the, in Texas, we're a community property state. Yeah. That's a, um, yeah. A misleading term to a certain extent because I, I can't tell you how many times a, a spouse will come in and they'll say, well, I don't need to go to probate because we've been married for 20, 30 years. It's a community property asset.
My name is on the Title two, and I have to tell 'em that doesn't matter. In Texas, essentially what happens is your community estate splits. When one spouse dies, it splits into a 50 50 division, and a surviving spouse has 50%. They keep theirs, but then deceased spouse's estate owns the other 50%.
Marie: So they're air, so Yeah.
Especially if you have, um, mixed families or Yeah. Or you know, and spouses and other, you might have children from another marriage and anyways. Yeah. It can get kind of complicated. We actually learned on my husband's side that I didn't quite think through, um, his mom passed many, many years ago. So we did an, um, affidavit of a mm-hmm.
Because there was [00:21:00] not, there's not a will. It'd be Roger and his sister who gets 50% of the home. Their stepdad still lives in the home. The stepdad has no, like legal rights, no heirs. Oh, we don't, oh, he has heirs. Well, he has heirs somewhere, but they're, it'll be complicated to figure out. Yeah, he has, um, he might, we don't know if his sister still living, but he, he still lives in the home and he's there, but I, I don't think he understands, like he doesn't.
Own the, the he the whole house. Yeah. He just assumed that when he, he owns the hundred per a hundred percent of the house. But, and I thought that the affidavit airship would take care of it. Well, it doesn't, it takes care of 50% of the house. We still have to get him to do something. So when, if, when, when he does pass, then that his 50% can go to somebody.
So then if not, it's gonna be very difficult to find. An air mm-hmm. Somewhere that we, that's [00:22:00] expensive, but we won't be able to do anything with the property. Yeah. Like it's stuck because you can't get
Catherine Byers: clear title.
Marie: Mm-hmm.
Catherine Byers: Yeah. Happens all the time. Mm. So the affidavit
Marie: should be did right for the, the 50% that Roger's mom's when she passed.
That's fine. And so they, both my husband and my sister-in-law own 25% each, but we still have 50% of that house that once he goes and he hasn't done anything. They're not the natural heirs for him. It has to. Yeah. Yeah.
Catherine Byers: Oh, that's tough. That's like a puzzle.
Marie: It is, it is. But I, someone's like collect puzzles, right?
Mean I started thinking about it. I was like, mm-hmm. Oh man, we gotta get that taken care of because he doesn't have a will. He doesn't,
Catherine Byers: yeah. What does he say about it? Have you ever said anything to him? Yeah. He's just not bothered. Yeah. Yeah. As they usually aren't, I suppose he's,
Marie: he's 80 and he's, he's in his 78 80.
He's, yeah, he's just happy living. I'm like, mark, we gotta do something, dude. Like, yeah. I don't care who you put, just put somebody so we can do something. '
Catherine Byers: cause again, you're, it's again, if when he's, [00:23:00] he doesn't care. But when he's gone, it's not gonna be his problem. Yeah. He, it's gonna be your problem. But in his thought,
Marie: he goes, oh, this goes, no, legally it doesn't, it doesn't go.
I thought the same thing. I'm like, mm-hmm. Oh man, we gotta do some more work. Yeah. Yeah.
Catherine Byers: That's like what we love, um, at the firm, I work at my associate and I love to go out and give as many presentations as we can in the community just to give people that education because you don't know what you don't know.
Right. And then by the time you find out sometimes it's, it's too late. It's too late. And then you,
Marie: um, I went and I happened. I went to a seminar just by chance and I was like, I didn't know any of this. And I, I kid you not, I was at least 50 years. Younger than anybody else in that room. Yeah, it was everybody who was like ready, like it was time, but I'm like.
More people need to know this. Yeah, they really do. Yeah.
Catherine Byers: You're never too early to get it done
Marie: because who people passed at any age. It's not only just old, but it was everybody there was so much older. And I'm like taking notes.
Catherine Byers: Yeah. So when someone comes to meet with you, um. Maybe someone like me that doesn't have a will or [00:24:00] any of these doc Yeah.
Many alarmingly any of these documents? What, like what does that look like? What are the conversations that you have? Do you like assess what they have and, and that kind of thing? Yeah. My, my initial conversation always is trying to get background on the potential client. I wanna know if you're married, if you have children, um, and what type of assets do you have?
Um, because essentially at the end of the day, we're gonna be left with the people. The stuff, right? And so I need to know from a planning point of view, how am I gonna make sure that these assets get to the right people and keep as much peace between the survivors? Because again, I can't tell you how many times people say, oh, well my kids get along and when I die, they'll, they'll work it out.
I'm like, okay, if you think so. But I mean, the reason I have a job is because, 'cause that's not true. Mm-hmm. I mean. Um, so I like to know what they have. Um, as far as like, especially for families that have young, minor children, we see a lot of times where you might put a [00:25:00] minor as a beneficiary on certain accounts, which is a big no-no.
Uh, again, how old is your, you said he's 15 and 17? I, I have 15 and 17, yes. Okay. So if a 15-year-old is a beneficiary on a life insurance policy and. You and your husband are both gone.
Marie: Mm-hmm.
Catherine Byers: They, again, they're under 18. They don't have legal capacity to, to manage that account. So your options are that money sits there for five years or three years until they turn 18.
Yeah. Um, which may not be that big of a deal, but sometimes you've got four year olds and five year olds who inherit this stuff. Um, and so they can sit there and wait, or whoever is left that hopefully you've put down who you trust to be the guardian for your child. They have to go in and again, start a court process.
Become the guardian for that child's estate. 'cause now they have assets. Um, and the court's involved with that until that child turns 18, which is a big pain and an expense.
Marie: Yes. I think just having something in place, just in case is always, is always good. That's just my nature. But it's scary. Like [00:26:00] when we sat down to talk to someone and like thinking of when the boys were little, like what would they do?
Who do they go? That was the, the, the, the horrible. Horrible. Just thinking about, yeah. Um, and I took, when I, I had to get my, my parents, 'cause we come from a split family. My, my father had a family before ours and then my mom did too. So we were kind of a Brady Bunch type thing. Sure. Um, and when I'm, thank they did something online a little bit.
They put something into place. That we had something when my dad passed, I fixed it after he passed. My mom passed a year later. I'm very grateful they had something that allowed me to make decisions for them. It took a, it was a long process to go through probate and all that stuff, but I had siblings that did not agree, and they wanted money.
Now I'm like, you're not getting money. Yeah. You, you, you can wait. Yeah. Mom and dad made me executive for a reason. Yeah, that's right. Wait. That's right.
Catherine Byers: Yeah. Yeah. I mean. And going back to the part about like, you know, the people and the things, like, I [00:27:00] feel like something that has held us back is like, where would our kids go?
You know what, what I mean, you know what? That is the number one reason why if I have a young couple or parents that they don't get their stuff done, they cannot, they, they don't know what to do with the children who's gonna take them. Yeah. I mean, like in our circumstances, my parents are, my parents are older, my dad is 70 now.
Um, my husband's parents are, are often unwell. I mean, they're not super, super healthy all the time, and so. While both sets of parents are wonderful, I just worry. I think like if we would name one a couple of things, if we would name one. What happens if they aren't around anymore? I guess you have secondary ones.
Is that true? Yeah. Yeah, you can. And then secondly, like wouldn't one be very upset by that information? Yes. Were they to come to find out, but then I think back to my parents and I think my parents picked like a family friend. Maybe to avoid that, probably we did. Yeah. Yeah. And I tell my clients all the time, it's, it's easy for me not being the person in their situation and [00:28:00] like kind of getting a, a bird's eye view.
Yeah. But I tell my clients all the time, I don't care if you're gonna upset people. Yeah. 'cause at the end of the day. It needs to be what is best for you and your family and your children and your stuff. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Um, it's hard for parents, especially if, if they have, um, older children that they're trying to also name in these documents.
Well, I don't want so and so to be upset. I didn't pick them. I'm like, too bad. Yeah. You know, it's, you, you, these are real life situations. If there are real life scenarios that happen, you've gotta pick the right person for the job because it is a job at the end of the day.
Marie: Yes, it is. It was two year job.
It's a very long time. But I had that conversation with my parents and I, when they asked me to do it, I said, I, I, or you will tell my siblings and this is why. Right. Mm-hmm. My siblings were very glad that they didn't have to do any of it. Yeah, yeah. But they do hold their hand
Catherine Byers: out pretty
Marie: quickly. Yes. Yeah.
Catherine Byers: Yes.
Marie: Mm-hmm. So, and it, it was, it was the, the sisters who are a, a little estranged that we had not seen there on my, my dad, my half sisters [00:29:00] on my dad's side, and, um, you the. I was very grateful that the, the five of us got along and understood for the most part, and kind of went along and they trusted me.
But that doesn't happen. I have friends who, who own, they're still for years fighting. Mm-hmm. That because it wasn't in the will have a, a good friend of ours that she, she lived, the whole family lived on a block together. They all own a couple of houses and rentals or whatever, and the dad was on all the properties.
Uh, so she. Was always taught like they paid the mortgage, but the dad said, this is your home. Like this is your home. You lived across the street. He helped the sister buy the house down the street and, and whatever. Well, when he passed, the sister said, oh, that's a third of mine. Mm-hmm. Even though it the, they all knew dad wanted that sister to have that home.
It wasn't in her name and she had to. In order to own the home. After he passed, I had to give her a third of that property. Yeah. Where she even, and she just [00:30:00] happened to be on title. Mm-hmm. And they did right for her property. But this is the property she lived in was not done. Right.
Catherine Byers: Mm. And I bet that tore that family up.
Mm-hmm. Oh yeah. People like don't talk to their siblings after, after a parent passes. Um, we also see a lot of, unfortunately, we see a lot of neglect, um. With an elderly parent and you've got the children fighting over, you know, who's gonna be in charge of mom or dad? Uh, we've been to court several times because the power of attorney, you know, has abused the power.
They've, they've gone in and they've taken, you know, a couple hundred thousand dollars from mom or dad. Oh gosh. Put it into account with their name on it. Right. And we have to sue them essentially, and take 'em to court. And, but it's, people get greedy pretty quickly.
Marie: It, it, that changes you, you know, when there's not an a, an authority figure in the picture anymore, like mom or dad.
Mm-hmm. It changes people. And, um, see, and we see, I see it in, in real, in, in financing. When you have someone, oh, mom and dad are helping us buy a house and dah, dah, dah, dah. [00:31:00] I haven't talked to mom or dad and mom or dad are are elderly, you know, and everything's electronic now. So it's like, I, I have to ask a lot of questions and people get kind of frustrated, but I'm like, I wanna make sure they're really helping you.
Yeah. I mean, a multimillion dollar house and you are saying Dad, and mom and dad are buying it for you. Like, we gotta have that conversation, so, right. Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Catherine Byers: Well, I would really encourage, um, any. Any parent out there who is being held back by saying, I don't know where my kids are gonna go. I always say, then, then we don't need to make that decision now, but let's get everything else taken care of.
Okay, so it's not like all or nothing. No, no. I mean, you can, you can get your wills done, you can get the other powers of attorney done. Because I, the worst thing that could happen is something happens to one or both of you and you didn't do the process because we don't know who's gonna take care of the kids.
Well now. We don't have anyone to take care of the kids, but nothing else is in place. Right, right. And so pursue everything else. [00:32:00] Get that stuff done, plan ahead. Mm-hmm. And then as you're going through that process, you know, we can figure out the, the child situation. Yeah. Maybe going through that process provides some clarity as well.
Mm-hmm. Have you found that? Oh yeah, absolutely. Because we'll start talking about who's gonna be the caretaker for your child, and they may say, oh, my sister, my brother. Then I'm like, well, how are they with money? Oh, they're terrible with money. And I'm like, oh, then guess what? They're not gonna be a trustee for your child's, your child's trust.
Even though you might think if they're gonna be taking care of the child, they would need to take care of the money too. So as you start kind of going through the scenarios, people start playing out some of these situations and realizing who's the right person.
Marie: We did that. We had someone who, when we named, who would have the boys, like a certain person would, they'd be with, but we found someone that might be better financially.
Handle the funds for them. Mm-hmm. Would be a better person. And then we also had someone who would like, make medical decisions on behalf of Roger and I. That was none of those people. Yeah. Yeah. That we [00:33:00] felt, you know, would make good decisions for us and, and then help counsel the PE I, I felt my sisters.
Would be too emotional. Oh yeah. To make logical decisions when it come to like end of life type stuff. Yeah. Yes. Yeah.
Catherine Byers: I always use my, my mom as an example for that kind of situation because she's not on my medical powers of attorney anywhere. Because she's emotional and I, I wouldn't wanna put her through that decision making.
But I have her listed on my HIPAA release document, which means if, if I'm in the hospital, she can call, pick up the phone, get updates on my healthcare. But I'm not, I don't wanna put that burden on her to make any kind of decisions for me. Medically speaking, you might
Marie: realize that the people that you thought might get their feelings hurt on some things might realize, have the relief that they don't have to make those decisions.
Oh, I know.
Catherine Byers: When I did my, my parents' estate plan and my, my oldest sister was a little bit offended. She was like, why am I last on everything? I'm like, you be grateful like this. You don't want these responsibilities and you don't have to make that decision. So it's, I tell people it's a job and it's a thankless job for sure.[00:34:00]
I can't, again, I can't tell you how many times I have a child who comes in who's been taking care of maybe an elderly parent that says, well, I, I've been taking care of mom and dad for the last, you know, 10 years. I, I should get more of the estate. And I'm like, you know what? You shouldn't. You're, that's your parent.
They took care of you while you were growing up and now it's your return to take care of them. Yes, but you know, it's a. It, you see all sorts of things Yes. Um, in this field. Well, we had,
Marie: I told you recently, um, we had a friend of ours refer someone to me and said, Hey, they're looking to buy their mom's house, blah, blah, blah.
So we were trying of talking about it, and she, it was a, a daughter living in, in her parents or her mother's home. Um. She wanted to now be it in her name, not her mom's name. Mm-hmm. So I was trying to explain to her, well you can, there's ways of doing it, but like financially, you can't buy the home from your mom 'cause your mom's not moving out.
Like, what's going on? Yeah. She was trying to protect that house. If mom passes, then she, it would be hers. Well, it doesn't work that way. Yeah. Yeah. Just because you've been [00:35:00] living there doesn't mean it belongs to you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. People tend to think that though. Yeah. That they've like acquired you. I'm like, we can, we can keep mom on title and add you to title and we can do a refinance and you can take over the mortgage or however you wanna do that, but at the end of the day, you still have to go through the estate part of this of when mom passes, right?
Yeah. Because you have, there's other errors other than that person. Yeah. So
Catherine Byers: well,
Marie: um. You're stressed out. Yes. She's like, oh my gosh. It's
Catherine Byers: so, it's so funny. I usually, when I go do presentations, I'm like, I'm gonna scare everybody into getting their estate plan done. Yeah. Yes. And it, and you have, and you have.
Um, but really quickly, what kinds of questions, um, would you recommend people ask when they're looking for an estate planning attorney? Good question. That is a good question. Yeah. They should just come look for me. Of course. No, of course. We'd love for them to come look for you. You know, I, I, sometimes I will have clients who come to me who have gone to a previous estate planning [00:36:00] attorney and they're like, they're so appreciative of me breaking it down and explaining it to them.
'cause they were like. The last one I had just said, this is what you need. And you know, here you go. Sign here. Yeah. I, I would want you to have an attorney that is asking not just the upfront questions, but the follow through questions. Like, what if this happens? What if that happens to a certain point? You kind of have to rein some clients in mm-hmm.
Because they can easily go down a rabbit hole. Yes. That is me. I am spiraling right now. But, you know, I, I, I want, I would want an attorney to ask about, you know, the family dynamics. What kind of assets do you have? Do we need to look at asset protection? Um, do we need to, you know, find ways to avoid probate and just, I mean, I would want someone to be very thorough.
Mm-hmm. I don't wanna just say, gimme a list of your, of your stuff and your powers of attorney. I'll draft that you come sign. Yeah. Uh, and some, and some attorneys do that. Um, we tend to find that on people that say that they practice estate planning or probate will, but they really, they really don't. Yeah.
Um, but yeah, having those hard conversations, [00:37:00] another fun, hard, uh, hard conversation. Um, to have is talking about spouses. If one dies, what's, you know, well, what if they go off and get remarried and they, they move the assets right to a different spouse, a new spouse, and not to the kids. So a, an attorney that's willing to, to kind of make you uncomfortable to a certain extent because we see all of that.
Yeah. And so make sure my husband can't
Marie: get married. He has become a priest. I really told him, yeah. I'm gonna haunt him. Yeah, I'm just kidding. I, I have a, I've
Catherine Byers: laid out rules for my husband too. I'm like, you, you can get, you don't have to get remarried, but you can't do. Excuse my money for like the first five years on a new lady or anything like that.
So, but oh my gosh, how funny. My best friend and I have talked about it in the past, which is like so morbid, but we always say like, we would just never get remarried. Mm-hmm. 'cause like, how awful would it be to have to like start all over? Like, you know, I'm not at all interested in that. Yeah. I say the same thing too.
I like, like, we're just gonna live on land and like have animals. Oh my gosh. I'll move in with you. That's, that's my, that's my, that's my dream too. I mean, [00:38:00] I've got a lot of girlfriends where it's like, we just wouldn't get remarried. We would just. Move into a house together. Yeah, of course. Because like, I'm not gonna like have to like train a whole new person.
You know? It's too hard and I don't wanna, I don't wanna share my stuff like with anybody else. No's, like's, like. It just gets, it gets so messy, so quickly and yeah, just live together and be happy and, you know, yeah. Keep things separate. But that's interesting that, I mean, you know, even just posing that question, what would happen?
Like, I think I would be offended if I worked all of these years and my kids didn't get that stuff. Mm-hmm. You know, and that's,
Marie: it gets, it gets where I think once we sat on, I, I need to update all them talk. I'm like, oh, I gotta update stuff now. Um, when we. It was so hard to go and do it. Yeah. It was the hardest thing.
I, I, I hated it. I hated it so much. But once it's done, I can't tell you what a relief it is. Yeah, yeah. You know, like I, I had something in place. Now that the kids are older, I can obviously change our will a little bit. And it wasn't, it wasn't horribly expensive. It wasn't, and I didn't, the, the meta, I didn't not know, I could not make decisions for Roger if something happened to him.
Yeah. [00:39:00] And that's what kind of made us kind of start thinking about it. He had an episode I, in our, I was in my very early thirties. I had just had. My youngest son and Roger had an episode at work. I thought he had a stroke. Mm. I like he was in the hospital for a week and we didn't know what was happening.
And it, I'm like, oh my God, I'm 31 and I'm gonna be a single mom. Like, what's happening? And it really made us think about like, what happens if something happens to him? Like, what do, what do, what do we do? Yeah.
Catherine Byers: Yeah. Nothing is guaranteed. Yeah. Unfortunately. And well, there are certain things that are guaranteed.
They say death and taxes, right? Yeah. Um, but everyone just is like, well, I'm too young. I don't need it. Like, eh, you know? Unfortunately we, we see all manner of ages. Yeah. You know, past or become incapacitated. Yeah. Yeah. Well this has scared the heck outta me. Sorry. But, but it's good. I mean, I have to, like, I'm 37 years old.
I have to be an adult now. It's time. And, and one thing we didn't really, I didn't really touch on, but um, just on the importance of these documents, especially for young families who may have a child, like with special needs. Sure. We were talking about that [00:40:00] earlier. Um. These parents who have a child that may need their legal assistance, right, to help manage their property and their funds, make those types of decisions for them past 18.
If your child has enough capacity to execute those documents, it's a really great way to avoid them having to obtain a guardianship over their child. Sometimes a, an individual has a very severe disability or incapacity where. The guardianship is the only choice. Um, but again, it's a legal process. It's expensive, it's time consuming.
And I see a lot of, you know, young parents who, or parents who have young children who they have to get guardianship over their, over their child. Yeah. And so if we're able to get, even, even if like a child comes to me and they may be. Maybe not a hundred percent. I mean, I have a conversation with them and I'll ask 'em questions like I would any, any other person.
I'm like, Hey, if, if you need to help with your medical decisions, you know, who would you trust? I would trust mom. I trust dad. So just even [00:41:00] being able to put that down for a child with special needs, it can save the parents a lot of, a lot of money and, and stress as that child goes into adulthood.
Marie: Mm-hmm.
Catherine Byers: Yeah, that's a good point.
Marie: Can't do, do these documents, get. Store like we have ours in a binder. Yeah. But like how do PE people know? Is there like a database or something? Yeah.
Catherine Byers: You know, that makes sense. Yeah. There's actually a lot of new, um. Uh, programs out there, like software programs where you can upload those documents.
Mm-hmm. I am supposed to be a millennial, but I'm really bad with technology, so I, I don't know any of those. Yeah. I'm old school. I have my binder, my parents have a binder, but I do let certain people know, like, this is where you can find it. Um, I tell people all the time, if you're going into the hospital, bring those documents, make a copy of it.
Um, so giving it to the right people, providing copies is a great way to ensure people know about it, at least
Marie: because I think, um, the only, like my. Parents when, when they passed, I didn't know where to find stuff. Like there's [00:42:00] statements and stuff and I'm like, I know they have something. Where is it? And once when my dad passed, then I was able to get things to come together and my mom let me handle some of the paperwork.
So when she passed and I had everything then, but it took me a while to put it all together and understand. And I've been asked. On my husband's side, um, he has an aunt and and two aunts that, that have never married, don't have children, and asked if I would be the executor and I'm like, Hey, you guys gotta put it where I can find it.
I can find it. Yeah. Because they have a very large home with a lot of. They like to shop. Mm-hmm. A lot of stuff. And I'm like, where would I look? I don't even know, like how to know if what they have. They just asked, Hey, would you do this? Yeah. Kind of thing. So I didn't know if there was like, is there like a database that they can,
Catherine Byers: there there is.
I I, I am not familiar with them. Yeah. I, 'cause I don't, I don't use them, but I've had other people tell me, oh you know, there's this program that you can use. Um, I do have a lot of clients who might have a safety deposit box. Yes. And they'll stick that in there. And I always have to remind them. Make sure whoever your executor is or who's next in line also [00:43:00] has access to that safety deposit box.
Because if you're gone Yeah, that's what my dad has. Yeah. But if, if they're gone and you're not on the account, they're gonna say, how do you get to it? I had idea, you gotta go to court. The bank
Marie: won't let you in. You gotta go to court, get to court order. That says take more time. I had a, a friend of ours said that, that all her mom stuff was in a they, which I thought that wasn't there.
And it happened not to be, but a, a safety deposit box thingy. Nobody had access. It took them year, I don't dunno, years, but very long time to get it. And unfortunately, what they thought was in there was not, wasn't it? Oh no.
Catherine Byers: Oh my gosh.
Marie: Yeah. Yeah.
Catherine Byers: There's
Marie: actually,
Catherine Byers: again, in the estates code, which again, I won't bore you with it, but there is something in there that says like, to a certain extent, if there's a safety deposit box, that a bank official potentially can go in there, look in the box to see if there's like a will.
Mm-hmm. And then if there is, then it, then the person can go to court and try to get an order for it. But yeah, at least then you would have the knowledge of what was inside versus. Interesting gambling. Oh my gosh. Oh, there's all sorts of fun things with this stuff. Yeah. And you,
Marie: you don't know what to, you don't know what you go through and you, you go through it.
Mm-hmm. [00:44:00] It is what it is. Yeah. So being prepared is a good thing, ma'am,
Catherine Byers: I guess. Yeah, that's what they say. That's, yeah. It's something where you get it done, and if you never need it, awesome. But if you need it and you don't have it, you know, you're kind of, you're kind of stuck with very limited options.
Yeah.
Marie: Well, you have kids, you have a, you have some assets and stuff, so eventually someone's going. Yeah. I think in
Catherine Byers: my mind I was always just like, eh, we don't really have anything to want. So yeah. What are we gonna do? You know? Yeah. Even if, if no one wants it, we're still gonna have to figure out where it goes.
Where it goes. Right. Yeah. Yeah. That's a good point. Yeah. Well, this has been super informative. We usually, um, at the end ask our guests to share with the listeners how people can get ahold of you. For your services? Sure. Yeah. Um, I'm actually, I work at Rosenblatt Law Firm. It's, um, on Ebner Road. The best way to contact me is either by phone or email.
The phone number for the firm is 2 1 0 5 6 2 2 9 0 0, um, or by email, which will be my first name, Catherine, C-A-T-H-E-R-I-N-E, [00:45:00] at rosenblatt law firm.com. Perfect. We'll put that in the show notes. Oh, notes. Yeah. So people can click around and get ahold of you. And thank you so much for being there. Thank you for inviting me again.
I, I hope I didn't bore you too much. No, it's, it is interesting stuff that we
Marie: need to know about, so into that 18-year-old stage, so I'm like, oh, I gotta do this again. Yeah, yeah,
Catherine Byers: yeah. Well, thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it. Absolutely. Of course. And I'm gonna also thank our listeners for tuning into this week's episode, and we'll catch you guys next time.
See you guys next week.
Thanks so much for tuning into this episode of the Working Moms of San Antonio podcast. We hope you love today's chat and found a little inspiration to take with you into your week. If you have a podcast topic suggestion or a question you'd love for us to cover, definitely send us an email at hello at working moms of san antonio.com.
We'd love to hear from you. And until next time, see you in the [00:46:00] community.
